self driven revelations

This was shared with Matt McGaw and inspired him to come to Canberra, Australia.

"The church in Canberra is in need of genuine fellowship"

However, his report is that after speaking with two or three local churches he gave up and decided to develop his own congregation.

Why?  Because those he spoke with did not want to take up the revelation

What happened when others who did support him approached him?  He told them he was not interested in working with them.

Unfortunately this is sometimes the way when God speaks to those willing to hear him, not all are willing or capable of pursuing things his way.  They come with agendas and therefore filter the world and the people in it.  

It is difficult to understand in situations such as this how people can claim to desire genuine authentic fellowship but feel rejected by those who do not want it and reject those who do.

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eating food offered to idols

Am reading the NT and re-encountered the part about eating foods offered to idols ...

• Knowledge leads to self-importance whereas love strengthens the church
• That not all believers know that there is one Father and one Jesus and therefore they continue to think that idols are real
• As such they, for example, will see certain foods that were associated with these idols (before becoming believers) as still attached to their worship
• Thus if they see anyone eating these foods it will create confusion: "How can you eat that, you are a believer, and now you are worshiping this false god"
• This confusion may then lead the new believer to eat the food they believe is wrong and therefore cause them to break their own conscience

So Paul says, it is better to forever more not eat that food rather than cause that confusion in them

NOW ... my musing is how this relates to today ... specifically:

• That not all believers know that since Jesus' death and resurrection there is no need to go to the mountain altars or city temples to worship because as he resides in us and we in him, we are free to worship anywhere anytime in truth and spirit.
• Indeed many believers continue to believe that attending a specific building is the only place, or brings validity to worship
• Hence, if they become aware that you are not attending a building or belong to a specific group it will create confusion: "How can you worship that way?" "If you are a believer, how can you claim authority or protection?" etc.
• For these believers, the confusion they feel could result in feeling they are being asked to do something they believe is wrong and therefore cause them to break their own conscience if they left their regular place of worship

The point I end my musings (at least in writing) is that I do not how to reconcile the final part ... suggestions please

So Paul says, it is better to forever more not eat that food rather than cause that confusion in them...

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God agrees with ME (friendship)

introduction

When you read the bible, how do you discover and understand what God means?  Do we simply read the words and go apply it?  Do we listen to a church sermon from or the advice of a Christian and simply do as suggested?

Why did Jesus say to the religious leaders and scholars of his day that knowing the words is not enough (e.g. John 5:39-40)?  What did he say we need instead?

Can understanding what God means occur by interpreting the bible through the lens of your society’s culture or your personal life experiences, preferences, desires, biases? (Isa 55:8).  Or should we be evaluating our culture and personal expectations through God's meaning?

Other things to consider:

[dropdown_box expand_text=" " show_more="click to read more" show_less="click to hide" start="hide"]

• Context ... How much of the message are you being told?  A few words, a sentence or two, maybe a paragraph.  The sentences before and after a passage or quote often bring what is being said into focus.

• Topic ... What is the real focus of what you are being told?  Is the passage or quote the focus of what is being explained or is it used to justify a predetermined theme or topic?  This is seen when a speaker starts with a quote but the rest of the time is used referring to personal and cultural concepts, ideas, presumptions, etc.
  [/dropdown_box]xample

example: friendship (top of page)

To explore this further, read John 15:12-15, a quote sometimes used to speak of friendship.

My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you. Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends. You are my friends if you do what I command. I no longer call you servants, because a servant does not know his master’s business. Instead, I have called you friends, for everything that I learned from my Father I have made known to you.
(John 15:12-15)

In a recent church service, the speaker chose this to open a message about friendship (audio).

Was the surrounding text (context) spoken of (John 15:1-27)?  No, these were the only sentences used.  In addition, they were used to open the message, a message among a series about relationships (topic), and explored by a list of cultural types of friendship and concepts (e.g. purpose, value, time needed, number of people involved) about friendship.

Does this passage clearly state that Jesus is teaching about friendship?  Yes.

Does this passage give an explanation for how Jesus defines friendship?

No. It only reveals that he was talking about friendship.

Was the text explored before or after to discover whether Jesus gave any further.  No.

So, what is the context of what Jesus was saying?

What did he say both before and afterward?befo

re

the text before (top of page)

Jesus gives an analogy where He is a vine, God the Father is the viticulturist (grape farmer), and people are a branch.

[table id=9 /]co

mmandments
what does Jesus ask? (top of page)

What are Jesus’ commandments?

• That we love one another, just as Jesus loved us (and the Father loved him)
• This means to lay down (sacrifice) your life for your friends
• As a result, a friend is anyone who does this

The benefit of this is that Jesus will share everything he has heard from God the Father.after

the text after (top of page)

Jesus continues his comments about friendship by stating that "the reason why the world hates you is because it hated him first."  Why?  Because when Jesus calls you out of the world you stop being part of it, and the world hates anything and anyone who is not part of it.  Consequently, since Jesus was persecuted, because God the Father is not known, so will you be persecuted. 

summary

summary (top of page)

To be a friend is to sacrificially love people.  This is how God the Father loves Jesus and Jesus loves us.  If you do:

• You will be glorifying God the Father by proving yourself a disciple of Jesus
• Jesus will share with you everything he has heard from God the Father
• God will prune you in such a way that anything you ask of him will be done
• You will be persecuted by anyone who doesn't know God

action plan: what to do next?

From the teachings of Jesus in John 15, is it possible to list the various types of friendship, or relationships we find in our society?  Is it possible to analyse their value or how to achieve them? Indeed does the teaching justify or prove our culture and personal expectations of friendship or other relationships?

If we take the teaching at face value, we must ask:

• How do we love people sacrificially? How did Jesus?  How did God?
• How do we prepare for and persevere through persecution?  What does persecution look like?
• How does God prune us?
• Do we limit our sacrificial love (friendship) to certain people or open ourselves to anyone?  What does this mean for our current relationships?  What does it mean for the people we currently exclude or don't see at all?

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homosexuality: a special sin?

introduction

Why are certain actions, attitudes, and ways people live viewed with a special kind of disdain?  Why are they given a level of badness above others?  Pedophilia, murder, rape, are just a few examples.

Another, and the example used here is homosexuality.  Why?  Because in recent years, not far behind when speaking of marriage, is the topic of whether or not homosexuals (people who sexually desire the same gender as themselves) should be entitled to marry, with the same legal privileges as heterosexual people (people who sexually desire the opposite gender to themselves).

NOTE: This exploration is not intended to prove whether or not homosexuality is acceptable or a sin.  Rather, it is an attempt to ask whether we are justified to judge and shun people based upon personal, social, or religious views.

marriage is for a male and female only

• “gay marriage” is bad  because…
• the act of homosexuality is bad, therefore …
• people who are homosexual are not normal and
• sometimes considered unsaved in a Christian sense

anyone should be allowed to marry (mm, ff, mf)

• I feel normal and/or I know people who are homosexual who are not bad.  In fact some state Jesus as their saviour. Therefore…
• I am normal, therefore…
• homosexuality is just part of who I am, therefore…
• when I want to get married I should be able to

quick analysis

The difficulty when entering this argument is both sides appear “right” in their own eyes. But have another look. A circular argument is occurring through the blurring of the lines between the person and their sexuality. We are equating the inner worth of a person with who they have sex with. Heterosexual marriage = good normal person. Homosexual = bad abnormal person. Therefore,

• if you disagree with gay marriage you probably have other judgments about the men and women involved
• if you are a man or woman who is homosexual you probably consider yourself an ordinary person because you know how you feel and think

what does the bible say?

There are four main passages in the bible that speak directly of homosexuality.  The first two mentions appear in this context as the Hebrew word shakab, meaning "to lie together sexually".  Both  appear in the same Old Testament book called Leviticus:

• “Do not practice homosexuality, having sex with another man as with a woman. It is a detestable sin." (Lev 18:22)
• “If a man practices homosexuality, having sex with another man as with a woman, both men have committed a detestable act. They must both be put to death, for they are guilty of a capital offense." (Lev 20:13)

The other two direct references to homosexuality is the Greek word arsenokoites, each within a different book of the New Testament:

Paul starts by explaining of our need to resolve disputes instead of taking legal action because that would prove our unwillingness to love one another. It is even better to simply accept the injustice put upon us and leave it at that (1 Co 6:1-8).

Why?  Because anyone, yes even you, who does wrong will not inherit God’s Kingdom!

The examples of wrongdoing Paul gives includes indulging in sexual sin, worshiping idols, committing adultery, prostitution, homosexuality, stealing, or being greedy, an alcoholic, abusive, or cheating (1 Co 6:9-10), murdering, slave trading, lying, breaking a promise, or simply having evil thoughts, deceit, lust, envy, slander, pride, being foolish (1 Tim 1:8-11; Mk 7:21-23), being hostile, quarreling, jealous, outbursts of anger, selfish ambition, dissension, division, envy, drunkenness, or wild parties (Gal 5:19-21).

Indeed, Jesus explained that all these things come from your inner parts and that it is this  inner stuff that defiles you well before you act upon it (Mk 7:21-23).

Read Matthew 5.  What is Jesus explaining?  Is it enough to point at people whose actions seem obvious because we can see them, or do we need to consider something else?  How can you apply what you learn here into the above list of 'wrongdoings'?

For example, finish the following sentence: “You have heard it said, no one who sleeps with another person of the same sex will enter God’s Kingdom, but I (Jesus) say to you …”

Paul then continues by speaking of our need to stop committing these acts once we realize who Jesus is and how he has caused us to be right with God (1 Co 6:12-20).  But does Paul declare one or more of the listed wrongdoings better or worse than any other? 

Why?

Which of these listed actions do you recognize in your life?  What about when you apply what you found by understanding Matthew 5 (the “you have heard it said” ones)?

Paul also explains that … God’s law, when used correctly is good because it helps people live correctly.  The law was "not intended for people who do what is right, but for people who are lawless, rebellious, ungodly, or sinful, anyone who does anything that contradicts the teaching of Jesus Christ” (1 Tim 5:8-11).

conclusion

So, if you found yourself guilty of any of the wrongdoings, then you are living in opposition to Jesus, and need God's law.  Does it matter whether you choose to include or exclude homosexuality in this list?  No.  There will be one or more other things you will be found guilty of.

Thank Jesus for his mercy.  For, even though Paul used to blaspheme his name, persecute, and kill his people, Jesus showed him who he is and why he came to earth.  By being forgiven, Paul became an example proving Jesus came to save sinners, all sinners, no matter how horrendous your actions (1 Tim 5:12-17).

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do we need to gather together?

If we are one with the Head (Jesus), we are one with the Body (church), even if we are not gathered together.  But, if we are not one with the Head, we are not one with the Body, even if we are gathered together.

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relational responsibity

Whose responsibility is it?

A woman is sitting on her own.  She is new to town and knows no one.  She does not even have family with her.

Whose responsibility is it to initiate an interaction.  Is it hers to introduce herself or for others to approach her?  Assuming she has a level of courage in this scenario, relationships could form even if no one approached her because she can make the first move.

But what if this lady has been experiencing some trauma in her life or something else that is causing her to hold back, to not make the first move? What if she is has a bad reputation or is physically unattractive?  What if her personality is different?  What if she has low self-esteem?  What if she finds it hard to trust people due to how she has been treated in the past?

Is it fair to suggest it was her responsibility if no interaction occurred?

What if this lady was you?

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in or out?

It has come to my attention that some Christians filter who may and may not gather with them during such times as a home group or bible study. The reason  is the new person would change the dynamics (e,g, learning stlye, maturity, gender, age, personality, denominational background, etc) of the group or not cope with the existing dynamics.  Therefore their presence would be considered disruptive.

Whether or not this sounds reasonable, is it acceptable?

Does God treat people this way? Did Jesus when on earth? What if you did this happened to your children?

Imagine saying to someone "Sorry, you cannot come pray and seek God with us because we are concerned you presence will disrupt the established group. We are doing things you may not be able to understand and we don't want to make the effort to change how we operate."

How you would respond if someone told you that?

May our doors be open to anyone willing to seek Him. Regardless of denominational or ideological background. Regardless of age, gender, socio-econics, or level of spiritual maturity.

May our minds and heart be open to Him so that we do not consider ourselves more important than others.

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God is all about relationships?

Today, the church often preaches about how God is all about relationships and as such so must the church.  We therefore have become accustomed to filtering what we do through the lens of relationships.  For instance, we only have the right to speak into another persons life once we have a relationship with them.  This is despite the fact that our very presence can be enough to affect another person's life, without have ever spoken a word to them let alone having met them.

We have also made our theology of God all about relationship.  God is the father, son, and spirit in continual relationship.  Occasionally, some believers will take the bold step and suggest people are invited into this relationship.

Now don't get me wrong, I am not opposing the importance of relationships.

But what I am pointing out is two things.  First, treating relationship this way is like the story of the elephant, where different people describe the elephant according to which part they were looking at: a leg, a trunk, an ear etc.  And as such they each spoke of the elephant in terms of the piece they could see.  Alternatively, what if the elephant is up a tree?  What if what we are describing looks like what we would expect a certain part of the elephant to look like, but we our expectations keep us distracted from looking up?

If we are doing this with God in terms of relationships, then what are we making the cornerstone of our faith and why?

Thus, the second point.  Could it be because our culture and society lack genuine relationship causing it to be the cry of our collective heart?  Could there be something more than what we experience through individualism?  Irony, in a desire to overcome individualism, we segment God into parts, father, son, spirit and then resolve this in terms of relationship, where we relate to one or more as our needs determine.

Again, not disregarding or diminishing relationship, trinity, or God's attributes. Just wanting to prompt us to consider what we doing and why.

Oneness

Jesus prayed that we be one like he and the father are one.  Is there distinction?  We are called to mature so we may be as the full stature of Christ.  We are to be in him and he in us... etc

This is like describing the colour green.  Yes we know and can show that yellow and blue are the component parts, and in a sense when we interact with green, we interact with mixed parts of yellow and blue.  But the truth is when you look at a frog or a leaf, you don't think or behave like that.  You only treat it as green.  We are not even contemplating how the bits work together.

Again, it is like when we send a christmas card to a household or a wedding gift.  Though we recognise each person involved, our focus os on the family, the couple.  Our love is for them as a whole.  Indeed, you may even sign off using your own family's surname.

The mystery that is God, the Church, etc...  Breaking him/us down while not 'bad', misses something.  And if we are doing this because of something we are missing in ourselves, communally or individually, then hmmm.

I pray that we are resolved in ourselves on this matter so that we may be one with one another and one with God.  And as such, just One.

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god healed the divide

If God desires there be no division between his people, where do denominational groupings within the church fit? What about those who are called believers and unbelievers

Paul appealed people to live in harmony with each other, without divisions in the church. To be of one mind, united in thought and purpose... Some claimed to be a follower of Paul, others Apollos, others Peter, or only Christ. But Christ is not divided into factions. Nor Paul crucified for you? (1 Corinthians 1:10-13)

After all, who is Apollos? Who is Paul? We are only God’s servants through whom you believed the Good News. Each of us did the work the Lord gave us. It’s not important who did what, but rather that God makes the seed grow. (1 Corinthians 3:5-16)

How does this apply when people say “I am a Baptist,” “I am Catholic", or “I adhere to no set denomination”, etc?

Was your minister, pastor, priest, mentor crucified for you?

If Christ is not divided into different groups, what are we doing?

If Jesus ended division by terminating the system of law with its commandments and regulations, then are the requirements we expect of people to belong relevant? If not, what do they do? How?

What are we to make of the promise of Christ in that there is nothing a person needs to do for God to forgive and embrace them? For all people? For all time?

Does placing requirements on people to belong create barriers to what God wants to do?

What are the commandments and regulations the church imposes today to belong? 
Consider things such as attendance of services, how we speak, what we wear, who we interact with, permitted activities, etc. Consider things such as how to pray, worship styles, or what it means to become saved.

What are the alternatives?

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our islamic brethren

dream

I was within a corporate building upon a floor with lots of rooms and offices.  Within one of these rooms I was speaking with a young lady, of the Islamic faith, who I used to work with in the kitchen of a nursing home.  As we spoke my left arm rested atop her right arm, including our hands.  In knew in this acton great affection was being expressed.

interpretation

According to muslim dream symbolism, limbs represent family amd arms brotherhood.   A muslim to dream of holding a woman represents loving the world and rejecting the afterlife.  However this dream, if of God cannot be viewed this way.

• The dream is not specific to this lady, her image was used because she is one of the few Muslim I personally know.
• Women represent God's people, thus the context here is people of the Islamic sphere.  They are people he is seeking.

Thus, this dream is a parable in nature.  It challenges people who profess Christ to treat Islamic people as God does, as his family regardless of your views on reconciliation.  It also challenges people of the Islamic faith to see God as relational, to reject the world and embrace eternal life.  Both are counter cultural.

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real love = attending church

The following is a response to a spoken message by Tony Rainbow of Victory Church (Adelaide, Australia) to the people of Fusion City Church (Canberra – Australia)

audio link

 

Topic being shared: Staying the Course

For the most part this message shared was positive.  However, part way through Tony stated:

"a person's church attendance reflects their real relationship with God.  If they are not attending they are reflecting a lack of genuine love for Him." Tony Rainbow, Victory Church, Australia - 27 Nov 2011

Given the information of the rest of the sermon, the context for this is attendance of Sunday church services.

In other words, Tony was suggesting that people who do not regularly attend a church service lack a genuine love for God.  Alternatively, people only really love God if they attend church services, preferably every week.

(This kind of comment is in the same category as those that suggest "Your love for God is measured by the amount of money you give to the church.")

Shortly after Tony stated

"If you hang around (spend time with) people who hate the church or speak against it, then we are going to become like them."  Tony Rainbow, Victory Church, Australia - 27 Nov 2011

Unfortunately the implications of this are:

• No one should speak against anything a church does, even if it does or says something counter to what appears in the Bible
• Decision makers and leaders of churches view themselves as infallible
• Anyone who raises a question of how and why things are done is seen as a hater of the church and indeed the people involved in it

And even if it is possible to ignore these comments, what are the implications for our relationship with God?  Ask yourself:

• Who did God send his son, Jesus, to hang around?  Did he become like them?
• Did he speak against religious attitudes and behaviours or people?
• Who did Jesus send his disciples amongst?
• People who pursue a life that copies Jesus will be hated and persecuted because the world first hated him (John 15:18-27).  Why does Gods warn us about this?  Does it mean we are to run away or persevere?  What does each choice here say about how we view God and Jesus?
• The Bible teaches us that we are not perfect and we make mistakes.  Is this is a reason to limit our relationships to those who agree with us and behave like us (Mt 5:43-48)?
• Consider evangelism.  Who is the audience?  How can discipleship occur if we are not to spend time people who disagree with us?

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community

God is birthing a community, uniting the Body of Christ and installing the Church into its intended position within the world.

No longer will there be a distinction between us (Church) and them (Community)

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